Greetings from Chilly Shropshire & what X should we be getting please?

[jmhc]

Hello XDrivers!

I thought it polite to say hello formally here.

We are NOT as yet X owners but are looking right now!

This is for my wife who is currently gadding about in a 98 A4 avant 2.8 Quattro Tip with sport suspension.  It has seen better days & recently got dinged rendering it effectively worthless.  She's still running though & has been for the last decade(the car).  BTW I run an Defender 130.

So to X's?

We tried a 2006 X3 M Sport 3.0d auto on Saturday & looked at several other vehicle types.  She rather likes the X3's comfort & power, she likes the ability to nip past etc. she likes & has got used to the 190BHP Audi.

Is it worth trying a 2.0d or perhaps a petrol version?, although this would require LPG to make it viable in the future.  I rather liked the "idea" of the 3.0 sd but the £500 VED is a bit strong perhaps?

Should we also be looking at the X5 in the 3.0d or petrol 3.0i or 4.4i varieties again with an eye for LPG looking forward to long term ownership.

We need a balance of economy, power, comfort, fun & dare I say reliability.  It will be used for commuting 2 hours a day at the moment, trips in the UK at least 6 times a year & possibly sojourns into Europe Camping etc.

Any pointers would be fab.

Thank you very much

JM

[Don Coffey]

Depending on just how high up economy is on you list should define what engine to go for. The 3.0d is streets ahead of the 2.0d but then mpg will be noticeable less in the 3.0d. For driving pleasure and reassuring overtaking I would go with the 3.0d.  I wouldn't go for a petrol as these won't be very good on economy at all 

If an X5 is in your budget then get that. Otherwise you could find yourselves regretting not doing so as you see other X5's go by.

Oh, and welcome to the site.

Don

[jmhc]

Hello Don & thank you for the reply.

What makes the X5 more desirable than the X3?

Cheers,

JMHC

[Don Coffey]

[quote="jmhc"]
Hello Don & thank you for the reply.

What makes the X5 more desirable than the X3?

Cheers,

JMHC
[/quote]

Size, prestige, quality of fixture and fittings, more standard equipment and often more optional equipment, so all in all more bang for your buck.

Don

[Don Coffey]

Sorry, I should have also added that this comes at the expense of economy and running costs. 

Don

[jmhc]

Hello Don, definitely not a Leaf & what an amazing deal.  It had me wondering, it's just the range & reliable grip around here.

Maybe I should forget resurrecting the Range Rover with it's V8 & LPG & convert to electric?  Hmm batteries, AC motor & drive, etc.

X5 or X3.  Yes being at least 350Kg heavier but only 100mm longer & an inch wider with a smaller boot 10l gets the X3 a couple more MPG & faster acceleration(if one is so inclined).

I read the fab  E70 guide by Haywoon.  Our budget is £7000 tops with a desire to have it equipped with the most kit as feasible, & not regress from the current A4.

3.0d (£285 VED)
Heated leather.
NO wooden trims.
Heat reflecting glass?
Auto dip mirror.
Folding door mirrors
Comms pack? (which I assume allows bluetooth connection to mobile phone).
Xenon lights.
SatNav (is this good/better than a TomTom or Garmin).
Sunroof (Or are we better avoiding this due to possible failure & leaks?).

As I am continuing my research are there any things to look out for, options etc.?

Is it difficult to retrofit items that are not fitted at manufacture? i.e. Xenons, sat nav and the like.

I have much to learn.

Thank you

JMHC

[X5Sport]

to the Forum.

In answer to some of your queries:

Satnav - yes the Tom Tom & Garmin offerings are better and include lifetime maps if you get the right one.  Retrofitting to the E53 and E70 is a major job and not for the faint hearted as additional wiring has to be run from front to back meaning a lot of the interior nay need to come out.  Later idrive sessions are all-in-one but above your budget.

HIDs/Xenons can be retrofitted with some modifications to the lamp units.

Heat reflecting glass was not standard, but some versions had a heat reflecting windscreen available.  You could spec privacy glass from the B-pillar rearwards.

Comms Pack should include bluetooth, but not streaming (arrived from 2010).

Retrofitting can be straightforward, but not always, and will frequently require some coding work to be carried out so you either need to know someone who does it or are brave enough to have a go yourself.

Richard

[jmhc]

Thank you & cheers for that Richard.

When you say coding do you mean using a diagnostic device to tell the vehicle's ECU/s that it's got those bits or downloading & hacking the firmware & actually altering the firmwares binary code.?

I would be up for the first but not for the latter.  Although I have not had any exposure to "modern" car diagnostic test gear as yet I am OK with PC's & electrical bits.

Many thank's.

JMHC

[X5Sport]

You need to build a set of the BMW coding software onto a laptop running XP and go from there.  It's a lot more complex that a diagnostic too because you are using what the Dealers use.  Just the car database is gigabytes in size!

If you have a look at bmwcoders dot com you'll see what is possible.  If you get it wrong you do have the potential to 'brick' a module and the car by accident.  It's not something to play with unless you are really careful.

Richard

[brewer]

Hi JM,
If I were you I think I would be looking to source a facelift E53 X5 3.0D Sport.  The reasons for this are as stated previously; size, stature (road presence), comfort, safety, kit, general fit & finish (including quality of materials).  For your £7k you will get a far superior machine when compared to a X3 in similar budget.

The first gen (2003-2010) X3 was pretty pants.  The second gen improved things a fair bit (assembly was moved back in house to South Carolina).

The first gen X3 was built by Magna in Austria.  The X5 has always been built by BMW in South Carolina.  X3 was built more to a budget as the sector is more price conscious and the manufacturing was outsourced.

I know two folks who chose the X3 over the X5 (my boss and a close friend) and both now regret this and are looking to move to the X5.

I have had my E53 since 2008.  Have run it for 7 years.  I purchased it @ 2.5 years old.  It now shows 125K on the clock and still drives beautifully.  Best vehicle I have ever owned.  I struggle to justify replacing it, not least as I find more latter day BMW offerings pretty staid (I would go as far as to say ugly) in the aesthetics department.  Plus, the E53 still does everything I want in a car.

FYI, I am likely not far from you as also based in Shropshire - Wellington in fact.

CHEERS.
Brewer

[jmhc]

[quote="brewer"]
Hi JM,
If I were you I think I would be looking to source a facelift E53 X5 3.0D Sport.  The reasons for this are as stated previously; size, stature (road presence), comfort, safety, kit, general fit & finish (including quality of materials).  For your £7k you will get a far superior machine when compared to a X3 in similar budget.

The first gen (2003-2010) X3 was pretty pants.  The second gen improved things a fair bit (assembly was moved back in house to South Carolina).

The first gen X3 was built by Magna in Austria.  The X5 has always been built by BMW in South Carolina.  X3 was built more to a budget as the sector is more price conscious and the manufacturing was outsourced.

I know two folks who chose the X3 over the X5 (my boss and a close friend) and both now regret this and are looking to move to the X5.

I have had my E53 since 2008.  Have run it for 7 years.  I purchased it @ 2.5 years old.  It now shows 125K on the clock and still drives beautifully.  Best vehicle I have ever owned.  I struggle to justify replacing it, not least as I find more latter day BMW offerings pretty staid (I would go as far as to say ugly) in the aesthetics department.  Plus, the E53 still does everything I want in a car.

FYI, I am likely not far from you as also based in Shropshire - Wellington in fact.

CHEERS.
Brewer
[/quote]

Hello Brewer,

Thank you very much for that, most illuminating indeed as Is AW8's Buyers guide.  Thank you to both of you!

How has your ownership experience been,  faults, failures, servicing & running costs etc.?

We need to get out & test a few (at  some dealers) to see how She(the customer) likes it.  She(the customer) liked the interior of the 06 M Sport X3 3.0d last week & ride.  We looked at an X5 nr Eyton, an "odd" dealer.  But we did not get a great feeling about "It" & therefore did not drive it.  A bit dopey perhaps but we do not change vehicles very often & did not want to mess folk about.

On a related note or two.

Whom do you use, recommend for spanner work etc.  I will be OK with oil changes & similar mechanical stuff .  Owning old Land Rovers & motor bikes rather forces that upon you   if we get a FSH vehicle it would be good to keep that up I would guess.  But I do not trust to change oil at 20K (2year)intervals, nor for that matter sealed for life diffs, transfer & gearboxs so would look to do that annually.(just the engine oil that is).

Are you aware of any trustworthy dealers in the area, most vehicles seem to be in Brum & it's suburbs so this is were I was going to try out a few dealers.

Are there any with experience of RAC Vehicle Checks.  I got a quote which was £275 to check over an X? with a 3litre engine(it goes up in price over 4l).  I don't know if this is worth it or not as I suspect if we purchased from a dealer & say a turbo failed after a couple of weeks they would try & welch out.  I did research repair kits & cartridges which seemed ok price wise at around £30 - £120 respectively.

It is indeed a small world, we are near Much Wenlock.  So not far at all.  She(the customer) was from Dawley, so we visit sunny Telford often.

Cheers,

JMHC

[brewer]

JM,
apologies for the delayed response.  Work and an impending wedding have taken priority!  However, I will try to give a comprehensive response.

My ownership experience over a period of 7 years overall has been little short of excellent.  The car is a true all rounder;
- seats 5 comfortably
- drives through (virtually) anything
- lots of load carrying ability (especially with the rears down)
- enough toys for me (nav, bluetooth, rear screens with dvd/ps3, freeview tv, heated seats front and rear, front & rear aircon, park sensors, rear window blinds, xenons, folding mirrors).  Of course, the way some of this is implemented looks old by todays standards, but most of it is still very usable.
- very comfortable and pretty effortless to drive with a lovely commanding driving position
- safety - lots of metal around you and a high position, plus DSC, four wheel drive and airbags everywhere!

Through my ownership period, I have averaged 29.7 MPG!  For a 10 year old, heavy (2 ton) car with a 3.0D 218 BHP engine on a 6-speed auto that is pretty decent in my book.  It's also got a 93L tank (!), which on one hand means over £100 to "fill her up", but on the other hand means you get over 600 miles from a full tank.

Another point, which might seem minor.  The car has a full size spare.  That is a real boon compared to all "modern day" BMW's coming with RFT's and no spare (or space for one!).

On the negatives front, maybe I have been lucky, but it's been pretty mundane (I personally have covered 100,000 miles in this car now).  It has broken down once and that was simply a flat battery (due to starter motor), which the good man from the AA was easily able to resolve.  From recollection I have had;
- new starter motor
- 1 new injector (recent)
- 1 new glow plug
- new exhaust manifold (original developed a crack)
- front bushes
None of these were particularly expensive and nor did any of them render the vehicle inoperable.

Obviously I have had standard service and wear and tear items such as tyres, pads, discs, wiper blades and normal service work (oil, filters, brake fluids, etc.).

A good indy can perform all your servicing and maintenance needs.  All of the above has been carried out over the years by a fantastic local outlet: http://www.autotechperformance.co.uk/  While granted they are not the cheapest, they do rank among the best, with the proprietor Pete Thorpe being a true BMW guru and meticulous with it.  He runs an impressive operation which is growing in reputation, just witness the Bentley's, R8's, Aston and other exotica he has in his service bay!

As said, if you like the interior of the X3, you should like the interior of a well specced E53, as it's a jolly nice, cossetted place to be.

Of course, when sourcing, a FSH is key, but that doesn't have to be BMW servicing and in fact many would value work done by a reputable Indy over that of the franchise dealer.  In any case, given the age of the E53 now, it isn't really economically sensible to go to BMW for anything but the most basic servicing, and then again I moved away from the dealer when the car was around 6 years old (the difference it makes to resale/residuals thereafter is negligible).

As an aside, having covered 126K miles, I have never had the transmission fluid changed and I don't intend to.  (Touch wood), the 6-speed ZF box on mine runs as smoothy as ever.  I guess there are two theories; a) prevention is better than cure and b) if it ain't broken don't fix it.  On reflection, I have fallen for the latter approach!

On the point of where to buy.  There are now few if any of these cars at franchise dealers.  Therefore, it's independents or private.  In my experience there is little difference between the two, other than price, with private generally being the lower cost option.  As the earliest examples (pre-facelift) are now 15 years old, many have gone off to the scrapyard in the sky.  However, there still seem to be plenty available.  Most facelifts (04-56) would seem to be in the £6,000 - £10,000 category (list price).  As said, for £7k you can get a lot of car.

Hope this helps a little further.
Cheers.
Brewer