tow bar snapped on bmw e53 53reg fixed from P F JONES

[mikejcb]

Hi everyone I have a 53reg x5 3.0d auto. I bought this just to tow my mini digger jcb 801.8 which weighs roughly about 1650kg which sits on a gx 8x4 ifor Williams plant trailer which weighs at a rough guess 500kg.

When I bought the x5 I had a tow bar from P.F. JONES fitted by a local mobile bar fitter. 6 weeks later the bar has snapped it is a witter fixed flange ball an pin.
The 2 bars that bolt to the chassis which have flanges fitted to allow tow bar to be attached have both snapped cleanly off about 10mm from the weld on the flange.

I took it back to P.F. JONES today and they are sending it back to witter but I had to pay for another one ?

Has anyone else had any similar probs if so please contact me
maybe loading and unloading which lifts the rear of the x5 up doesn't help BUT I have towed this set up for years with Isuzu troopers and Nissan Terranos and its never ever affected them in any way what so ever

Will witter have to refund me ? can I get them to pay if it has caused any Damage etc. as it was only the bumper which held it on and stopped it from totally detaching and god forbid killing someone.
Any Advice would be really appreciated thank you Mike

[Horizon]

I suppose its a plant trailer where you are using the loop and draw pin arrangement. ? When I worked in plant hire and spent loads of time pulling plant trailers and compressors around I found that it puts miles more load on the towbar as there is no cushioning effect. The pin causes a snatching affect everytime you change speed. This may have contributed to the demise of the standard towbar. What weight is the towbar rated at?
Very alarming to think it could have come adrift at 60 MPH

[mikejcb]

Hi Horizon thanks for the reply. witter are rated at 2500kg which is within my legal limit. the scary thing is which I forgot to mention and probably the most important is that when I purchased the x5 it did come with a fixed bar fitted and believe it or not that snapped the same place, I don't know what make that was but the witter went in the same place. At the time I just thought it was a one off with an old bar but clearly this is not the case.

[shadrack]

you know pf jones do a 3.5t towbar for the x5, doesnt an 801.8 weight 1.8t hence the 1.8? my dad just sold one the other week, also plant trailer probs weights more than 500kg as there pretty heavey duty, i had the 2500kg one on my x5 and towd all sorts of big 16 x 7 ifor trailers with cars and tractors on and never had any issues though i was on detachable one with 50mm ball.

hows your trailer loaded? boom and bucket on front end could make a very heavey nose weight and the bars are only rated for 100kg nose weight

[kjb1]

that is shocking [emoji15]

needs full investigation to establish whats going on.  Sounds like it WILL do it again until root cause is found.


Sent from my iPhone

[mikejcb]

[quote="shadrack"]
you know pf jones do a 3.5t towbar for the x5, doesnt an 801.8 weight 1.8t hence the 1.8? my dad just sold one the other week, also plant trailer probs weights more than 500kg as there pretty heavey duty, i had the 2500kg one on my x5 and towd all sorts of big 16 x 7 ifor trailers with cars and tractors on and never had any issues though i was on detachable one with 50mm ball.

hows your trailer loaded? boom and bucket on front end could make a very heavey nose weight and the bars are only rated for 100kg nose weight
[/quote]

Hi Shadrack sorry your wrong it ways exactly 1560kg cabbed, nothink to do with 801.8 as that's just top of the range ie expanding tracks etc. as to trailer well im allways getting pulled by V.O.S.A so no probs there either. as to the 3.5 tonne ones yes they do and they are trust ones and the guy in pf jones said there the same as witter ones ??

[X5Sport]

Nose weight in either direction is very likely the cause, especially negative load if as you describe the X5 is lifting when you on/off load. Can you not put down legs on your trailer to stop it loading the tow bar whilst loading/unloading?  I know I had a number of their trailers in a fleet and all had corner posts for use during load/unload to make sure the tow vehicle did not take the strain on the coupling.

If it's incorrect loading then Witter will walk away.  You will have to prove it's their error - as is so often any manufacturers response these days - and did not 'abuse' the coupling in any way.

The E53 towing capacity is 2300kgs braked, 750kgs unbraked

Does your trailer not have a breakaway cable to put the brakes on?  At least you leave the accident behind rather than have it alongside/chasing you.....

Richard

[mikejcb]

[quote="shadrack"]
you know pf jones do a 3.5t towbar for the x5, doesnt an 801.8 weight 1.8t hence the 1.8? my dad just sold one the other week, also plant trailer probs weights more than 500kg as there pretty heavey duty, i had the 2500kg one on my x5 and towd all sorts of big 16 x 7 ifor trailers with cars and tractors on and never had any issues though i was on detachable one with 50mm ball.

hows your trailer loaded? boom and bucket on front end could make a very heavey nose weight and the bars are only rated for 100kg nose weight
[/quote]
Sorry Shadrack forgot to say yes boom and bucket is at front but as I said trooper and terrano never had any issues and I've been towing with them since 2002  O:-)

[X5Sport]

Both of which are built for that sort of use, the E53 isn't.  Both of those have at least 500kg higher towing capability.

If you need 3.5T on an E53 then it needs extra gearbox and engine cooling (same as the E70/71 and F15).

[mikejcb]

xsport it doesn't matter if trooper and terrano have 500kg more mate, either way im under the limits legally and im asking about towbar NOT cooling system

[mikejcb]

[quote="X5Sport"]
Both of which are built for that sort of use, the E53 isn't.  Both of those have at least 500kg higher towing capability.

If you need 3.5T on an E53 then it needs extra gearbox and engine cooling (same as the E70/71 and F15).
[/quote]

x5 sport can you explain why an x5 is NOT built for that ????? and why Terranos are ?????

[X5Sport]

No that's fine, it was for info only if you ever thought about upgrading the capacity. 

Is the Witter better than the Westfalia supplied as OEM?  I know that is a detachable, and that might be an issue?

I thought the OEM ones were 3.5T rated, even if the car isn't.  The equivalent on my X6 is, though the car is only 2.4T I believe.

Knowing BMW, they probably only thought horse box or caravan behind the car...l )  the Terrano and Trooper are more of a 'work' vehicle whereas the E53 is a luxury car, so different criteria, and hence lower tow limits.  Different target market, that's all.  If BMW wanted it to be a more general tow vehicle for work then it would surely have a 3.5T limit 'out of the factory' in the same way Land Rover etc do with their models, as well as the Japanese.  They all have higher nose weight limits too I think...up to 150kgs for some.

Richard

[mikejcb]

[quote="X5Sport"]
No that's fine, it was for info only if you ever thought about upgrading the capacity. 

Is the Witter better than the Westfalia supplied as OEM?  I know that is a detachable, and that might be an issue?

I thought the OEM ones were 3.5T rated, even if the car isn't.  The equivalent on my X6 is, though the car is only 2.4T I believe.

Knowing BMW, they probably only thought horse box or caravan behind the car...l )  the Terrano and Trooper are more of a 'work' vehicle whereas the E53 is a luxury car, so different criteria, and hence lower tow limits.  Different target market, that's all.  If BMW wanted it to be a more general tow vehicle for work then it would surely have a 3.5T limit 'out of the factory' in the same way Land Rover etc do with their models, as well as the Japanese.  They all have higher nose weight limits too I think...up to 150kgs for some.

Richard
[/quote]

Richard either way luxury or not the vehicles are rated as to what weight they are safely allowed to tow
the x5 is supposedly capable of towing my set up ? there for luxury or NOT Richard they say that it is safe to do so. as to x6 weight I don't know sorry you prob know more as we do not use ours for towing. MIKE

[shadrack]

[quote="mikejcb"]
[quote="shadrack"]
you know pf jones do a 3.5t towbar for the x5, doesnt an 801.8 weight 1.8t hence the 1.8? my dad just sold one the other week, also plant trailer probs weights more than 500kg as there pretty heavey duty, i had the 2500kg one on my x5 and towd all sorts of big 16 x 7 ifor trailers with cars and tractors on and never had any issues though i was on detachable one with 50mm ball.

hows your trailer loaded? boom and bucket on front end could make a very heavey nose weight and the bars are only rated for 100kg nose weight
[/quote][/quote]

fair enough my dads was expanding tracks, probs nose weight i used to chock trailer at back with blocks when loading/ unloading tractor, car trailer tilts anyway and had legs
Hi Shadrack sorry your wrong it ways exactly 1560kg cabbed, nothink to do with 801.8 as that's just top of the range ie expanding tracks etc. as to trailer well im allways getting pulled by V.O.S.A so no probs there either. as to the 3.5 tonne ones yes they do and they are trust ones and the guy in pf jones said there the same as witter ones ??

[mikejcb]

[quote="shadrack"]
[quote="mikejcb"]
[quote="shadrack"]
you know pf jones do a 3.5t towbar for the x5, doesnt an 801.8 weight 1.8t hence the 1.8? my dad just sold one the other week, also plant trailer probs weights more than 500kg as there pretty heavey duty, i had the 2500kg one on my x5 and towd all sorts of big 16 x 7 ifor trailers with cars and tractors on and never had any issues though i was on detachable one with 50mm ball.

hows your trailer loaded? boom and bucket on front end could make a very heavey nose weight and the bars are only rated for 100kg nose weight
[/quote][/quote]

fair enough my dads was expanding tracks, probs nose weight i used to chock trailer at back with blocks when loading/ unloading tractor, car trailer tilts anyway and had legs
Hi Shadrack sorry your wrong it ways exactly 1560kg cabbed, nothink to do with 801.8 as that's just top of the range ie expanding tracks etc. as to trailer well im allways getting pulled by V.O.S.A so no probs there either. as to the 3.5 tonne ones yes they do and they are trust ones and the guy in pf jones said there the same as witter ones ??
[/quote]

Hi Shadrack all 801.8 do come with expanding tracks, 2 speed tracking etc and they all weigh 1560kg. as to chocks good idea I will certainly use them as legs may not be doing the job properly, but what gets me mad is THEY STILL SHOULD NOT SNAP SO COME ON WITTER LISTEN TO THIS BEFORE YOU HAVE BLOOD ON YOUR HANDS, Thanks shadrack for you replys mate