XSeries-forum

Just watched the latest episode of TopGear on iPlayer!

I loved the Fake X5 they came across in China!




They even said BMW took the manufacturer to court...and lost!

A few more google pics:

Looks ridiculous!!

Turks.

They even copied the folding mirror fault.

......

Underside rear numberplate & Lexus/Toyota style front clusters though so not entirely a copy of X5 IMHO.

wiki link

There was an article in the press a year or so back looking at a whole raft of 'clone' models offered in China. None of which will ever be offered for sale outside the country because of the copyright rules. Some of he clones were very obvious, but none were built to anything close to the European build standards/regulations.

It also made it clear that none of the manufacturers of the legitimate versions wold ever stand a chance of a successful prosecution. Same issue with most Chinese 'clones' as their rules are much more lax.

There were ven reports some time back in the IT press about CPU production lines running a little 'longer' than a stndard shift so that extra 'grey narket' COUs cold be made. More than one major computer manufacturer has been caught out by buying what it thought was legitimate components only to discover they were anything but.

It's getting rarer, but it's still a problem.

My father in law used to work in the high vacuum industry manufacturing the machines that actually make these chips. European manufacturers lost out to cheaper Asian copies using Chinese Steel. There was a problem though. This steel was 'porous' at an atomic level and leaks, meaning the incredibly high and pure vacuum needed for making LSI components could never be maintained and the chips were contaminated and no good.

Now that's interesting. I work in the semicon side of the high vacuum industry. Who did he work for?

Any inside pics ?

[quote=""Bargain Bucket""]Now that's interesting. I work in the semicon side of the high vacuum industry. Who did he work for?[/quote]

Edwards, then VG Semicon (?) a firm in Crawley which has since gone bust, or at least made most of its team redundant. They used to make the machines used for mobile phone chip fab I think. It all went East, although he did some consultancy in the US, that's dried up too now.

I remember talking with him about how this steel 'leaked' even though it was inches thick. Seemed incredible, but was a known issue. Something to do with the molecular gaps in the alloys. But then I guess when you're working at as near zero atoms/cm3 as you can get, it's much more important. Given the latest chips work in nanometres (0.000000001m if my tired Maths still works) even atoms' size become important!

Makes 'clean room' dust levels look like garbage heaps..

I think its pretty scary that that end of the world will soon be dominating the 'west'. Half of them have already taken too many of the jobs at my place of work via the likes of big western companies making a quick buck (ala IBM/intel) from cheap resource!

No conscience about the crap they are making as long as its cheap enough to take over the world.

exatly!

that x5 and the fact that the case was lost (havent seen top gear yet) - unbelievable that this world has to put up with bullsh1t - one copyright law for the rest of the world, and then another for them!!

they'll keep copying and doing every dirty job under the sun and their govt will protect them, in the local market with billions of mouths to feed, all those are legitimate practices.

and then those industries mature and start penetrating the export market; by which time they'll improve quality and resolve issues like being unable to make proper metal without it being porous!

cost of production will gradually increase but remember - there are millions if not billions below the poverty line.

that's the oppty they have to take on the world!! with lower cost of production!!

if the west is to keep the industrial base goin there should be no comfort in the thinkin that quality is a weakness in the east. it is, for now, but it won't be for long, and id rather not be caught with my pants down!

what the hell to do is a diff question

is there a good lesson to learn from the japs though. they also had this issue a few decades back, with production costs goin through the roofs. look at them now, with every jap company making their cars in most global markets locally, and they sit pretty in with their global companies!

true but the size of japan cannot compare to China and India(population wise). TG said 16m cars were made in europe last year - China made 1m more!!! And there enough road surface to cover the entire surface of england...and scotland. 85m cars on the road in china....wtf

Some manufacturers are beginning to move production from China to other Asian centres such as Indonesia, Vietnam and Thailand because of 'quality' issues. Cost is not now the prime driver it seems.. There have of course been a number of recent high profile major issues with quality control in China - it was kiddies toys a couple of years back.

[quote=""X5Sport""]Some manufacturers are beginning to move production from China to other Asian centres such as Indonesia, Vietnam and Thailand because of 'quality' issues. Cost is not now the prime driver it seems.. There have of course been a number of recent high profile major issues with quality control in China - it was kiddies toys a couple of years back.[/quote]

well their own buildings are crumbling down due to bad quality to start with.. few dozen workers died last year.. but i don't see that as a lasting issue. they'll fix it.

[quote=""X5Sport""][quote=""Bargain Bucket""]Now that's interesting. I work in the semicon side of the high vacuum industry. Who did he work for?[/quote]

Edwards, then VG Semicon (?) a firm in Crawley which has since gone bust, or at least made most of its team redundant. They used to make the machines used for mobile phone chip fab I think. It all went East, although he did some consultancy in the US, that's dried up too now.

I remember talking with him about how this steel 'leaked' even though it was inches thick. Seemed incredible, but was a known issue. Something to do with the molecular gaps in the alloys. But then I guess when you're working at as near zero atoms/cm3 as you can get, it's much more important. Given the latest chips work in nanometres (0.000000001m if my tired Maths still works) even atoms' size become important!

Makes 'clean room' dust levels look like garbage heaps.. [/quote]

Amazing. I work for Edwards.