Car stalled! Any ideas?

Imy · Post by **Imy** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 11:31 am

Bit of a strange one.

Topped oil up in my car. Started it, drive it or 3 seconds and the car stalled. The electrics were still running but I lost steering and brakes, I let the car roll back before applying hand brake to stop the car. Waited 5 seconds before restarting and it was fine.
Was it a simple stall?
I'm worried it may happen again but in a more tricky situation...

sitrom · Post by **sitrom** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 1:59 pm

Imy,
I have been having this issue with my car for the passed 6 months or so. It keeps stalling when it's hot and going round a roundabout for instance or when I take off at the traffic lights, there is a slight hesitation, the revs drop and the car stalls.

I had my car scanned at a local garage and the diagnosed that the cam sensor is gone, which apparently leads to the stalling. So my car is booked next week to have the sensors replaced. In the meantime be careful as it might happen round a bend as it happened to me many times and you lose the power assisted steering which makes it really tricky to control the car.

jaynana · Post by **jaynana** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 4:31 pm

sitrom, interesting because i once had this in a 318i. never could figure it out.

pls let me know how it goes next week after the sensor replacement.

thx

j

Imy · Post by **Imy** » Thu Jul 26, 2012 2:32 am

Just out of curiosity, how much were you quoted for the sensors?

I thought cam sensors really only affected the car when you were travelling at speeds over 60mph although I could be wrong...

jaynana · Post by **jaynana** » Thu Jul 26, 2012 4:57 pm

cam sensor replacement did not do the job for me in this specific instance so they didn't charge for it (which is why i wanted to hear your story on this issue), but i had had to get the cam sensor replaced before on my then 318i.

it was a long time back so i really can't remember,.. i think it was around £350 incl labour (not a stealer, my indy).

ok now that i possibly raised your curiosity here's what happened to my 318i, it was a 52 reg 318i about 4 years back.

car when properly warmed up, would randomly hesitate to accelerate after stopping at a traffic light, round-about, etc, at the most annoying point when i like to step on it hard. i could prevent it totally stopping by letting off the accellerator as on idle, when the rpm dropped below .5 sort of, engine management electronics would kick in to raise it up. if i try to accelerate while engaging clutch it would drop and stall the engine.

the quick and sure fire way to get back to normal was to kill the engine (with the key) when its struggling and re-start. car would start as normal and behave absolutely normal... untill it happened again, totally randomly.

so what did i do:
back then i didn't own a scanner, so it was straight to my indy. my indy said nothing indicated on the scanner, better than him doing guesswork to take it to BMW.
BMW said nothing shown on the scanner, they suspected a, b & c, and tried replacing a, b & c. nothing worked. they tried replacing various sensors, tried new spark and cables, tried couple of other things as well.
when nothing worked eventually they opened a case with bMW munich as well (or so they told me)
waited for various diagnosis from munich, which i'm not sure if they really happened or not, eventually after about a month they said there were no timelines as to when they'd be able to help (i was not on any warranty), and returned the car!!!
because the car was not under warranty with bmw, they had no liability to fix it, except if i insisted they could replace the whole engine and charge for it!!!
because they couldn't fix the car they refunded all the money, didn't charge except for a nominal fee for something.
another month or so - nothing at all happened.

i later lodged a complaint with the bmw group re. the condition of cars sold supposedly a premium brand and the level of support, stating the stealer and the case reference etc.
BMW came back saying said they were sorry, and that they were in fact looking into the case as the stealer had told me, and that they would come back to me.

they never came back. they haven't come back to this date.

in summary bmw couldn't figure out what was wrong with their own car!
i had no options with them either as i was not under any sort of warranty cover!

so there goes.

didn't want to write all this and discourage you or give you heartburn in case its the same cause, that's why i said this was very interesting but refrained from detailing out the experience!

lets hope urs is much simpler, hope for the best, pls let me know how it goes.

the stealer was bmw holland park in london btw.. i have never gone there again! i drive much further to a diff. stealer for my matters X.

X5Sport · Post by **X5Sport** » Thu Jul 26, 2012 5:25 pm

........replace the whole engine eh?

Talk about sledgehammer to crack a nut!! Probably a bit of dodgy wiring in the system but because their 'technicians' are stuck if the computer won't tell them what's wrong, they sound completely clueless and didn't know what to do.

I had a Calibra in the early 90's that would do this. It did bring the ECU warning light on but they never found the fault as nothing was recorded. Network Q offered to 'try another ECU' as long as I paid £800 up front. I pointed out it was under warranty so their problem. Network Q wouldn't play so I gave them the car back and got a refund. Bought a Cavalier SRi which was good as gold for the next 5 years until sold on.

Imy · Post by **Imy** » Thu Jul 26, 2012 9:19 pm

Hmmm well it's only happened the once so far and it wasn't on a round about or hard acceleration so fingers x it doesn't happen again!

jaynana · Post by **jaynana** » Fri Jul 27, 2012 12:26 pm

[quote="X5Sport"]
........replace the whole engine eh?

Talk about sledgehammer to crack a nut!! Probably a bit of dodgy wiring in the system but because their 'technicians' are stuck if the computer won't tell them what's wrong, they sound completely clueless and didn't know what to do.

[/quote]

exactly what it is in today's world .. imagine how they'd train and deploy a technician - get a few guys with necessary qualifications, check-out their basic mechanical skills, give them training on how to use the diagnostic system! and off u go fellas - go fix cars!!

if the computer doesn't tell them they're totally stuck with no common sense or experience or knowledge..

to be fair the cars are also too complicated and computer driven which is why its going that way..

stevox5 · Post by **stevox5** » Fri Jul 27, 2012 8:49 pm

I think labelling dealer technicians all with the same stigma that if the diagnostic machine does not inform them of the actual fault they are stumped is unfair.
It is probably the case that some individuals are of this caliber but not all. Also the myth that the independents are knights in shining armour is not always the case. There are good and bad in every instance I think and there are some very clever dealer techs as well as good independents .
Just my opinion, not meant to be an argument just a different perspective.

Raj · Post by **Raj** » Sat Jul 28, 2012 11:58 am

[quote="stevox5"]
I think labelling dealer technicians all with the same stigma that if the diagnostic machine does not inform them of the actual fault they are stumped is unfair.
It is probably the case that some individuals are of this caliber but not all. Also the myth that the independents are knights in shining armour is not always the case. There are good and bad in every instance I think and there are some very clever dealer techs as well as good independents .
Just my opinion, not meant to be an argument just a different perspective.
[/quote]

Tbh I agree. Most independents were trained technicians to start with so if they were useless technicians at the dealer then are just going to be useless independents also.

X5Sport · Post by **X5Sport** » Sat Jul 28, 2012 3:28 pm

That's a fair assessment I suppose. In the experiences I have had over the 7 years of BMW ownership I have to say I have not yet met such a clueless bunch. Yes they do have the odd one or two good techs but the majority really seem stuck if the computer gives them no answer, or worse still the wrong answer.

I think my biggest concern is their apparent inability to spot that what the computer is telling them is not to be taken as gospel as it may not really make sense. I know I've said similar before, but these computer systems are an 'aid' not the final decision maker. As an engineer I was taught to work from first principles and use the test equipment as part of my toolkit. I have used four different BMW Dealers and amongst all their techs only two individuals have been able to really work things out to get to the bottom of any troubles.

Perhaps the drive to get as many cars a day through in as little time as possible and also BMWs refusal to allow in depth fault analysis means these guys and gals aren't able to build up the experiences they need to do a proper job. Let's face it we probably know more collectively about our cars than any Dealer......and that (IMHO) is the wrong way round.

Owners expect their Dealers to know what's wrong and how to fix it quickly and for the lowest cost. Changing a complete engine to solve what was probably a simple electrical problem may be quick in comparative terms of fault investigation but the cost is horrendous, and that approach hardly engenders trust or faith in that Dealer.

As with all Dealers there are no doubt some really good people about, same in the Independant field (Jason and his team being just one good example) but from what frequently gets reported on here - they are rare. Around here in north Bedfordshire I have yet to find a good one in either camp.

Perhaps I should be a BMW Workshop Manager instead of an IT Manager.......how about 'Xdrivers - your ultimate BMW support team'......

sitrom · Post by **sitrom** » Wed Aug 15, 2012 4:27 pm

Just an update following picking up my car from the garage after it had to stay there for 3 days. The final result was that apparently there are 2 camshaft sensors, and that both had gone. Both of the were replaced at a cost of £280 including labour and I have to say that it transformed the way the car drives. Not only has the stalling been eliminated, but even the gear changes and the down shifts feel a lot smoother. Maybe it is a placebo effect, however both the guy at the garage and my mate have told me that it drives a lot smoother.

Raj · Post by **Raj** » Thu Aug 16, 2012 7:29 am

[quote="sitrom"]
Just an update following picking up my car from the garage after it had to stay there for 3 days. The final result was that apparently there are 2 camshaft sensors, and that both had gone. Both of the were replaced at a cost of £280 including labour and I have to say that it transformed the way the car drives. Not only has the stalling been eliminated, but even the gear changes and the down shifts feel a lot smoother. Maybe it is a placebo effect, however both the guy at the garage and my mate have told me that it drives a lot smoother.
[/quote]

Glad it's all sorted.

Turks · Post by **Turks** » Fri Aug 17, 2012 4:32 am

[quote="sitrom"]
Just an update following picking up my car from the garage after it had to stay there for 3 days. The final result was that apparently there are 2 camshaft sensors, and that both had gone. Both of the were replaced at a cost of £280 including labour and I have to say that it transformed the way the car drives. Not only has the stalling been eliminated, but even the gear changes and the down shifts feel a lot smoother. Maybe it is a placebo effect, however both the guy at the garage and my mate have told me that it drives a lot smoother.
[/quote]
Did you have this done at the Dealers?

I had a phonecall from my missus yesterday saying that something strange happened to the car so its a hell of a coincidence that this thread should pop up again! I'm currently out of the country so haven't experienced it myself...

Anyway, she was sat on the hill outside of my Fish & Chip shop and she started the car. She put the car into 'D' and pressed the accelerator which is when all power disappeared and the car started rolling back with no steering or brakes! She put the handbrake on right away safely stopped the car. It hasn't done it since and all was fine when she re-started the engine.

I'd like to get this fixed if I know what it is - my car is still under Warranty!

Turks.

sitrom · Post by **sitrom** » Fri Aug 17, 2012 1:27 pm

Nope, i had it done at an Indy near where I live. The guys diagnosed and even took a drive with me in order to witness the fault. The symptom was almost identical to yours every time it was stalling, the was a hesitation and then loss of power, and then no steering and no brakes. They have been taking care of my car for the past year and a half and am very happy with them. Unfortunately today my car had to go back there as it went into Limp Home mode yesterday with indications of speed wheel/ABS sensor malfunction. Oh well, Hopefully this will be the last bill for this year.

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