Thermostat & Warranty...

[gileso]

Hi All

Recently started looking at the DPF regen logs for my car (2009 35d) and had some mild concern that it hadn't happened for quite some time. Looking deeper into the problem, there were a couple of clues - all glow plugs and controller replaced a few months ago (all failed/weak) and engine temp never getting above 70 degrees.

So back to the dealer...

Me: The car isn't getting up to temperature. It won't go above 70 degrees and the optimum operating range is around 88 degrees.
Them: Certainly Sir, we'll look into it.

4 hours later
Them: Car is all ready.
Me: Great - did you have to change the thermostat.
Them: No, we turned the heater system up
Me: Why?
Them: You said the car wasn't getting up to temperature, so we turned the internal heater up.
Me: The engine temperature! Not the cabin temperature. Why would I want the cabin temperature to be 88 degrees?
Them: Oh 

1 day later
Them: Car all checked and it is fine.
Me: Great - what is the engine temperature now?
Them: Its within operating parameters
Me: What are the parameters?
Them: I can't tell you but the mechanic said they couldn't find any recorded faults
Me: Give me back my car and don't touch anything else!  >:(

So, without any recorded faults, there is no problem to fix and the dealer won't do anything. Given the main thermostat is a PITA to change and there is no EGR one, I'll probably go to an indy to get it changed.

The question though is when I do this, and find a fault with the thermostat, could I claim it under the extended warranty?

[X5Sport]

You can try, but the thermostat may be classed as a consumable and the warranty may require a main dealer does the work.  What does the 'small print' dealer get out of jail text say?

[Wipeout]

Had the same response here from a main dealer, even gave them a Carly app log showing the low temps (mid 70's) over a couple of hours driving, they said it was ok and as its not showing a fault code there is no problem. I've bought the thermostats and will sort it myself.

[X5Sport]

Wonderful....technicians who believe computers tell the whole truth and if it isn't flagged as faulty then it isn't.  Makes the proper engineer in me seethe!  None of the current lot know how to work from 1st principles.  No wonder the public has no faith in the motor service industry!

[Greydog]

I became an engineer because I had something inside me that needs to now "how it works and why". So X5 that now qualifies you officially as an "Old Bloke Engineer" because you have that need to know.

Main Dealer staff today are not engineers they are well trained in Customer relations, and work shop staff understand the Otto Cycle but have no clue about how different control elements interact to effect their products efficiency. They just learn where they are and how to change them if there is a fault.
They cant understand that two or three sensors operating at the lower end of their range with no fault can combine, the result is a reduction in efficiency and problems for the owner. Still it is probably out of warranty by then so it wont bother them at all!! Rant Over

Sadly this is true in many areas today. Recently we went to a local Pub for lunch ordered a couple of drinks and some food, 10 mins later we were told sorry we cant serve you there's a power cut the tills and kitchen ordering system are down ?? So I suggested opening the door to the Kitchen and asking the Chef if he could make a sandwich the answer was yes we could do that but we wont be able to make up your bill ????
Total reliance on technology with not a thought for the old analogue pencil and paper

[X5Sport]

Old Engineer and getting older......yup that's me 

[gileso]

Here's the update from anther Old Engineer.

Zero (none, nada) feedback from the dealers, despite thir promises to let me know what the 'operating parameters' actually were.

Anyway, car off to indy today. Turns out the 35d does have an EGR thermostat (despite what RealOEM shows). So both thermostats changed. Carly now reporting temp at 95 degrees, car feels smoother and MPG has gone up by 10%. Admittedly not a full test, but looking good so far.

I have the replaced parts and am very tempted to dump them on the dealer's desk...but will take it up with the warranty people first.

[Nat]

Go for it................

Ask for a meeting with the Dealer principal, head of service , the technician , the head of training.
Take your go pro and record it ........and tell them its for training purposes.
Show them the transcript of the previous meeting where every " technician " is a clueless twat.
Then dump the parts on their desk and ask why they charge over £100 an hour + vat , when they can't seem able to test let alone change a simple thermostat or two.

No surprise to find that a main dealer is utterly shite. What I  cannot work out is why BMW themselves accept this abhorrent level of service at their dealers.

[gileso]

Letter written to dealer Chief Exec and copied to BMW UK MD (not that I expect an  answer of course, but it makes me feel better)...

BTW - Indy charged 3hrs time plus parts - including a static pressure test and a drive test as well. Given that the DIYers are saying its probably a minimum of 4 hrs if you know what you are doing, I feel content with what the Indy has done.

[gileso]

Well there's a result. Email from BMW UK MD, putting their Customer Care team on the case, an email from the Dealer Principal and a (partial) refund to boot. Still awaiting the formal technical response from the garage but I'm surprised at how quickly they have responded. I guess you don't get if you don't ask...

[Nat]

Wow....................result. You want to print/frame that.

I bought an AUC car from a dealer and the day after delivery it broke down. Was recovered to my local BMW main agent and when they plugged it in was full of faults. BMW warranty refused to pay for the work saying car had been sold with pre-existing faults. Contacted BMW UK. Did they help? No. They bored me off and were not in the slightest bit interested . The rest is a very long story.

The fact you even got a reply is a miracle. Very well done.

[martin33100]

The engine and EGR cooler stat on these 3L diesels is so common, had to change them on our 07 E91 and 57 E70 to get the coolant temps up from 70degs.

[ssrfr03]

Hi
You say there is no EGR thermostat on your 35d ?? I have just changed both on my 2009 35d are you sure you don't have one ?

[gileso]

I wasn't sure that the EGR 'thermostat' was actually a thermostat (read it on another forum that the twin turbo EGR system was different).

However, in Reply 6, I did point out that I had come round to thinking that it was a thermostat. RealOEM indicates part no: 11717787870 which is the same for the single turbo, so QED.

The indy replaced both parts, so whatever it was - true thermostat or not, it got changed.

[martin33100]

Just wanted to update on our 57 E70 3.0d, changed both stats 3 years ago and I have just noticed slightly longer warm up times and low 80's when on a motorway run.

Do these need replacing every 3 years to keep the temps up!!!!